How can one barely go to S.A. ? Let’s be realistic, Colombo went out of the box. What he did was to challenge the entire beliefs system of his time. It seems we tend to minimize how people thought in those days which ,in turn, minimizes CC work. In the context of his time and in actual navigation, seamanship , exploration , in my opinion is/was immense.
I think it is very valid to demonstrate the value he added in history! But it's also worthwhile to see how it has been incorporated for other purposes and at times purposefully misleading.
He never was willing to admit he found anything other than the eastern coast of India, so no, he wasn't challenging much. There were people before him who had already postulated that there might be another continent, and he demonstrably ignored them when he returned to Europe. There are better people to point to like Amerigo Vespucci, who maybe gives Italians less of a bad name. To venerate Christopher you kind of have to not recognize actual history as it was. Oh well, I guess. I'm sure Texas and Florida won't let this fantasy version of him be forgotten, so you have little worry about.
In all seriousness, The Sopranos was way ahead of its time with this question, as least as far as it concerns Americans. Tony and Co. spend the entire episode trying to preserve Columbus day in Newark with all the usual tactics (He was a brave Italian explorer!) . But it's revealed that Furio, who was born in Italy, doesn't like Columbus because he was Genoese, and the Genoese think they're "better than everybody." One of the native protestors is part Italian. And the head of the tribal casino is very clearly a white guy. Silvio, who apparently cares very much, doesn't even go to the Columbus parade because he "forgot it was a Monday."
True - but there has always been a tendency of having 'up to date/approved' versions of history versus previous versions which might have been debunked.
You're playing fast and loose with your interchangeable adjuncts of 'outdated' and 'false.' No, there's no point in teaching the lies, other than citing their original inception as a feint by the tribal ruling class to cover up their ancestral horrors.
I think you are right a clear definition between the two would be helpful - as something can be true but no longer approved or false but currently in the text books. They are not interchangeable concepts.
Read the same yesterday on BBC, so I expected that's what this post would be about and was waiting for the punchline. Was not aware about a Columbus day in the US before.
Thank you for this. Like Mark Twain once wrote," it's easier to fool someone than convince then they have been fooled." Why anyone believe Christopher Columbus came to North America is beyond me, other than they were taught that without any investigation. But so as with His-story- and we still refer to the natives of North America as people from India. Go figure
Well, in 1492 Columbus DID sail the ocean blue. And he was not responsible for the Trail Of Tears. So the revision that took place casting him as The Reason the locals across the entire continent were brutalized is not history and is false to facts and should not be taught. We do need to teach history acurately but that does not include propaganda and ideology which are simply not based in history.
In response to Alan D.'s comments on religion; a very dear friend who is much, much older and wiser than I said that "religion is the study of lies and mythology is the study of psychopaths."
How can one barely go to S.A. ? Let’s be realistic, Colombo went out of the box. What he did was to challenge the entire beliefs system of his time. It seems we tend to minimize how people thought in those days which ,in turn, minimizes CC work. In the context of his time and in actual navigation, seamanship , exploration , in my opinion is/was immense.
I think it is very valid to demonstrate the value he added in history! But it's also worthwhile to see how it has been incorporated for other purposes and at times purposefully misleading.
Let's be realistic, he was lost.
Stregoni, he didn’t find exactly what he was looking for but what a surprise..
He never was willing to admit he found anything other than the eastern coast of India, so no, he wasn't challenging much. There were people before him who had already postulated that there might be another continent, and he demonstrably ignored them when he returned to Europe. There are better people to point to like Amerigo Vespucci, who maybe gives Italians less of a bad name. To venerate Christopher you kind of have to not recognize actual history as it was. Oh well, I guess. I'm sure Texas and Florida won't let this fantasy version of him be forgotten, so you have little worry about.
In all seriousness, The Sopranos was way ahead of its time with this question, as least as far as it concerns Americans. Tony and Co. spend the entire episode trying to preserve Columbus day in Newark with all the usual tactics (He was a brave Italian explorer!) . But it's revealed that Furio, who was born in Italy, doesn't like Columbus because he was Genoese, and the Genoese think they're "better than everybody." One of the native protestors is part Italian. And the head of the tribal casino is very clearly a white guy. Silvio, who apparently cares very much, doesn't even go to the Columbus parade because he "forgot it was a Monday."
Whatever happened to Gary Cooper?
The definition of "history" implies that it is always outdated. It's all about something that already happened.
True - but there has always been a tendency of having 'up to date/approved' versions of history versus previous versions which might have been debunked.
You're playing fast and loose with your interchangeable adjuncts of 'outdated' and 'false.' No, there's no point in teaching the lies, other than citing their original inception as a feint by the tribal ruling class to cover up their ancestral horrors.
I think you are right a clear definition between the two would be helpful - as something can be true but no longer approved or false but currently in the text books. They are not interchangeable concepts.
... and speaking of outdated history: today I heard this news that Christopher Columbus might not even have been Italian: https://www.euronews.com/culture/2024/10/14/christopher-columbus-revealed-to-be-spanish-and-jewish-in-new-documentary
Interesting!
Read the same yesterday on BBC, so I expected that's what this post would be about and was waiting for the punchline. Was not aware about a Columbus day in the US before.
https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/ckg2049ezpko
Yes! Learn in order to provide the wisdom of the cultural context all the way back to Genesis 1:1
Thank you for this. Like Mark Twain once wrote," it's easier to fool someone than convince then they have been fooled." Why anyone believe Christopher Columbus came to North America is beyond me, other than they were taught that without any investigation. But so as with His-story- and we still refer to the natives of North America as people from India. Go figure
P.S. not a mark Twain quote
Well, in 1492 Columbus DID sail the ocean blue. And he was not responsible for the Trail Of Tears. So the revision that took place casting him as The Reason the locals across the entire continent were brutalized is not history and is false to facts and should not be taught. We do need to teach history acurately but that does not include propaganda and ideology which are simply not based in history.
It is very hard to find out what is accurate and what is propaganda... even today!
In response to Alan D.'s comments on religion; a very dear friend who is much, much older and wiser than I said that "religion is the study of lies and mythology is the study of psychopaths."
Take our language, history and values back.
Concur - and we can learn a lot by that evolution as well...